My colleagues and I produced this video as part of our discussion on the topic:
I maintain a view that is unpopular around Luther and contrary to what is taught in my CYF classes. I can't help but think about my experience on Sunday mornings with my sons, my youngest son in particular. More often than not, Maddox, who's 8, gets much more bang for his buck when he goes away with kids his age to learn about Christ.
If he stays with me, invariably he will be asking me every two minutes about where we are in the service. He's sitting there checking the church bulletin to see how much more we have to go before the service is over. Now I love my son and his behavior doesn't bother me in the least, but it is distracting and takes away from my experience during the service too.
So I ask my colleagues as I ask Ms. Pearson, couldn't your problem really be with the quality of your Sunday school? I've been to places where my son had fun and still can tell me about what he learned in his "kiddie side session" with other kids. I don't see why someone would think that delivering the message to children in a format in which they better understand is a bad thing, as a mater of principle. The long term affects of this practice are also debatable and in there I also disagree.
I think the implicit messaging is the problem -- that is, that children have to be "some place else" but not in REAL worship. I could ask the same question of the service that you're asking of the Sunday School. That is, why is your son so bored with it? I think the issue is not doing away with Sunday school, for some churches that's a great pedagogy, but instead asking in THIS church with THIS community, what's the best way to support lifelong learning in faith?
ReplyDeleteI could see how some might have that impression. But, when we send children to grammar school, are we implying that they are not in REAL school (college) or they are not doing REAL work (vocation)? Just as we study cultural influences in worship, the same consideration should be given for age. Church services can not be "one size fits all". I don't think its reasonable to fashion a service that is going to satisfy everyone either.
ReplyDeleteAs I think about a Hip Hop service, I already know some people are not going to attend, if no reject, if not protest against such a service. However, such a service is a response to worship services that are not reaching this demographic.
Ms. Pearson makes similar suggestions to what I've heard in class. I think they are interesting, but have limited potential.
I think you have a valid point about worship not being able to be "one size fits all" for all age groups. There is value in attending church as a family however. Our church is currently working toward a two hour worship block on Sunday morning where the family attends age appropriate Sunday School for an hour and then attends worship together the second hour. As we put this together in anticipation of launching it in the fall we understand the congregation will need to change some of their views about worship. Some people will need to allow the noise of fussy kids to enter our worship space and Pastors will need to include more children messages in the service. While I was attending chapel at Luther in June someone read the Genesis reading from the Sparks Bible for kids. It was great to hear all the added sounds to the creation story which brought all of us into the story at a whole new level. I am considering using this bible for readings in worship (not every week, but when appropriate) especially for the family service time.
ReplyDeleteTony,
ReplyDeleteGreat discussion point, one I struggle with deeply myself. Currently we have the approach your talking about in the church I serve. I debate with myself about the message I am indeed sending to our young people. Our faith journey is one we are meant to take together. I am looking for a way that both honors our young people unique situation and needs as well as makes them realize that they are participants in every aspect of the life of the church. I very much struggle with the disconnect between the worship life of my congregation. In my situation they have sent the children off to Sunday School under the guise of doing what's best for them, but I question if it isn't really doing what's easiest.
Tony,
ReplyDeleteWhen I was a child, there was no such thing as "children's church," so the option to leave the service did not exist. However, I was also part of a tradition that confirmed much earlier than our modern Lutheran church does (I was 11!), so I was invested in the process of worship as an active participant at a much younger age. I kept my son active, too, but teaching him parts of the service and expecting him to gradually increase his participation as he grew up.
Now, I will readily admit that I had a child who was patient and sat well in church, but not everyone does. The thing I get from your post is that different kinds of worship experiences speak to different children, just as they do to different adults. Why should children be any different than adults in this way? If we choose to have both options, a set-aside, children-only service and a place for children within adult worship, why not? Personally, I wouldn't choose to pull my child out, but that's because of who he is and keeping him with me worked for us.
It's good that you are discussing this topic with colleagues and presenting a contrasting viewpoint at Luther. That's what creates spirited and thoughtful and faithful conversation!
Amen to the continuing discussion.
ReplyDeleteSince you're taking the Ed 2 course, I'm sure that you've gone through the first session. I think it was the book "Fashion Me a People" (don't have the author's name offhand) talked about the whole business of community formation - that a "real" community has at least three generations talking to each other, telling and learning God's story and how our stories' flow into and across those lines; and in my humble opinion, worshipping with each other.
Two places where I'd go dig some more and look at ways to make community of saints' worship work. The last four congregations I've attended had a "children's sermon" specifically for the 8- to 10-year old and under crowd. Second, there should be ways for the kids to be active in the service at more than one point.
The kids need to be with old guys, and the old guys need to remember how to worship as little children in a lot of ways. And the teenagers and middle guys need to have their perspectives stretched to see the big story as well.
Yes, there are times when the younger crowd needs to break for a time and do the peer identity stuff, but that's where "Sunday school" has them hanging out with their buds.
Love the tension. Each child, each adult, each person will have different predilections, different initial tolerance for living together with the other. But the unity of the community is at stake, and it seems that keeping the Body of Christ together is a goal worth working for. Most of the time, the Sunday morning hour or two is all that's available to the community.
One of my heroes talks about sermon prep - doing it in a way that pieces can be understood by the pre-schoolers, yet has pieces that challenge the PhD crowd. But has all of the people there.
Amen to the the continuing discussion!
All I can think of is "both and". I don't think it is one or the other but both and. Our worship and Sunday school are at different times so families can worship together and children can attend Sunday school. I believe there are benefits of both. One key point is geeting the young people involved in the worship service in some way, so they become participants.
ReplyDeleteEach worshiping community is unique and must address this question of actively inviting children into the worship. While at intensives I attended worship at St. Anthony Park Lutheran. There was a baptism that day. Their tradition is to invite all the children to surround the font and be up close and personal with the newest member of the body of Christ, while reaffirming themselves as members of the holy catholic church. Their faces were bright with the glow of acceptance and love they felt from their community of faith!
ReplyDelete